No, not whether they are real, but what exactly they are. From your link's author:
The clinical phenomenon commonly called “trigger points” is all too real, but still unexplained. I have moderate science-based confidence in the “tiny cramp” theory of trigger points.
The author also states:
"There’s lot of hype and B.S. about trigger points, and way too many professionals now believe in them like religion.
The trigger point marketing horse is far ahead of the science cart.
Current methods of trigger point diagnosis and treatment are sketchy
There is plenty of overlap between decent trigger point therapy and an ordinary pleasant massage."
The last point in particular raises eyebrows, in that it's entirely possible that just the normal tissue massage on sore areas of the body is as effective as a special 'trigger point' massage
ChgoGuy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:23 am
Believe it or not, work has been the best medicine for me. Even better than DCT.
This is interesting. Greg Clark, who is probably the biggest fanboy of DCT, said in one of his interviews that ironically his symptoms were at their worst when he tried do have alone time, peace and quiet, do meditation, paradoxical relaxation, etc. That's when his mind would fixate and obsess on the condition. On the flip side beiing busy was when his symptoms were at their lowest levels
hailtotheking wrote: ↑Sun Dec 15, 2019 9:10 pm
The last point in particular raises eyebrows, in that it's entirely possible that just the normal tissue massage on sore areas of the body is as effective as a special 'trigger point' massage
I don't disagree with you. The "pressing for 90 seconds" may not be the ideal treatment. I have trigger points in my shoulders, and I find different forms of massage effective, not only the 90-second press. For instance, I use a Wahl vibration massager, and I'm investigating the use of a percussion massager, which I think could be even more effective:
On the flip side being busy was when his symptoms were at their lowest levels
Yes, being busy is a better distraction for some men.
Any news on the subject? Before I invest in a TheraGun I wanted to see if anyone tried it on here. I have a brookstone massager - I believe it is much gentler - and I feel it helps a tiny bit. And I am wondering whether stronger percussion helps more.
My main problem is in the levator ani (pubo muscle mostly) so it is kind of delicate but closer to surface. I do use a Theracane for deeper TPs in the pelvis, but I have not seen much/consistent improvement in levator ani area through internal massage. Sometimes doing internal massage worsens the flare up. For some reason I feel wiped out after it, extremely fatigued.
Re: Stubborn trigger points (Ramana's Case)
Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:48 pm
by webslave
NeoKortex88 wrote:
David McCoid doesn't believe trigger point manual therapy to be much more than a anesthesiacum.
Not sure what you mean by "anesthesiacum", but keep in mind that people like David Wise, PhD psychologist, who had CPPS for decades, cured himself using trigger point therapy and a relaxation technique. On the other hand you have David McCoid, who has a BA (Political Science), and along with Nic Bartolotta, seems to be part of a marketing scheme aimed at patients: https://www.reddit.com/r/PelvicFloor/co ... ting_CPPS/
I am forced to assume that you, NeoKortex, are part of this scheme because of your many (over 30!) DCT-promotional posts (which I have now edited to remove the spam), and so I must warn you that any post you make in the future promoting DCT will be deleted, and you will be banned.
webslave wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:48 pm
Not sure what you mean by "anesthesiacum", but keep in mind that people like David Wise, PhD psychologist, who had CPPS for decades, cured himself using trigger point therapy and a relaxation technique. On the other hand you have David McCoid, who has a BA (Political Science), and along with Nic Bartolotta, seems to be part of a marketing scheme aimed at patients: https://www.reddit.com/r/PelvicFloor/co ... ting_CPPS/
I am forced to assume that you, NeoKortex, are part of this scheme because of your many DCT-promotional posts, here and at other sites, and so I must warn you that any post you make in the future promoting DCT will be deleted, and you will be banned.
It's really bad that there is something out there that can help and besides freedom of speech and all you have not even tried it. You know uptown Mike who promoted the A Headache in the Pelvis stretches he is doing DCT now out of curiosity and he will make a video about it once he has enough information.
The reference of PhD vs BA and all is not really a measurement of quality. I am a high academic myself and I should know ;) Look at the most successful dropouts like Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Mark Zuckerberg.
Anyway I hope you get a chance to try DCT yourself and make an educated guess. And no I am not in any way affiliated with DCT. As a matter of fact I criticized them openly in their Facebook Forum and the posts are still there go look them up. (They didn't block them or ban me, and I still tell people there I initially healed with static stretching)
Also I am not shitting or talking down on David Wise, anyone who fights this evil is a saint. As are you, Mark.
I hope we can have a more open less prejudice discussion in the future about potential cures and what not.
Edit: it's true their market very aggressively. They gave members 20% affiliate bonus they also offered to me. Beside that I didn't accept it I have never posted a referral link/promocode/asked anyone to pm me. Again you can look up in this forum I didn't do it. Their marketing is led by a third party BTW.
Re: Stubborn trigger points (Ramana's Case)
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:52 pm
by webslave
NeoKortex88 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:12 am
It's really bad that there is something out there that can help and besides freedom of speech and all you have not even tried it.
I don't need to try it, I am cured. I only warned you because your posts contain numerous (like over 30) promotions of DCT (now removed). I can also find numerous posts by you at other sites with comments like "DCT by David McCoid is the best stretching program". You're doing this all over the place, and spending a lot of time on it. If it walks like a duck, sounds like a duck, and looks like a duck, it's probably a duck.
The reference of PhD vs BA and all is not really a measurement of quality.
Oh yes it is. One is a mental health expert, the other is nothing (medically speaking).
I am a high academic myself and I should know ;)
I doubt it. I have to edit all your posts to correct the bad grammar and make them readable for other members, which I don't mind because you are not a native English speaker, but I note that your constant use of "Iam" for "I am" would not be something one would normally see in a highly educated person, no matter what their native tongue.
Look at the most successful dropouts like Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and Mark Zuckerberg.
Business entrepreneurship and medicine bear no relationship to each other.
Anyway I hope you get a chance to try DCT yourself and make an educated guess.
I don't need it, it doesn't even seem sensible to me other than being a slightly different way of stretching, and my educated guess is that any treatment that pays people to proselytize is a scam. If they were serious about helping people, they would not be hiding stretching techniques behind a paywall.
And no I am not in any way affiliated with DCT.
We have no way of knowing if that is true or not. I suspect strongly that it is not true because you have published the phrase "DCT by David McCoid" so many times, all over the net. It looks very much like a marketing effort.
I hope we can have a more open less prejudice discussion in the future about potential cures and what not.
I have no prejudice, and I am completely open to discussing DCT, but I won't have people salesmen here trying to con the readers.
I think you are now aware not to promote it any further. We know how you feel about it, no need to sing its praises again.
Okay, enough with the DCT mystery, mumbo-jumbo and secrets behind paywalls. I'm asking anyone who has paid these guys money to be told how to do stretching to confidentially send all info you have to me via email, webmaster at ucpps.men, so I can publish it here for discussion. Your name will not be mentioned.
I regard this as totally fair, now that we know that the DCT people are paying patients to recruit people by posting success stories all over the place, including here. This is my response to them. Now I wish to open up their "secret methods" so we can see if there is anything special about them, or if it's just another slightly different form of stretching (which I suspect).
Eventually someone will come along and tell us all about it. Nobody has written to me about it yet, not sure why. I've seen these fads come and go for years now. This is just another one.
